Helix RTA & Auto EQ - A Car Audio Junkies Exclusive

Thanks Nick for the video. I'm a little late to the party. I just tried this out and I'm very impressed. This did in 15 minutes what took me months to achieve. It sounds just as good if not better than my personal tune. I like to use PEQ but have always used graphic in the past with great results. I think the big advantage of this is TIME. This will be an easy way to try out different house curves, store them in presets, and compare the results.
 
I thought I ready about this somewhere but I cant seem to find it, maybe I missed it.

Is there a way to either import individual curves for each speaker, or even better use the assigned XO curves so the Auto Tune can calibrate each of them one at a time? That sound like the best way to get the "perfect" setup.
 
Hey guys, some of us were recently talking about the RTA and its auto eq function in the Helix DSP software. I realized that even though i work with these things daily for the past 2+ years, i have never even used the RTA or its auto eq function, so i decided to give it a shot WHILE also filming it to show everyone how to use it. Since i was filming it while i personally was figuring it out, your going to have to excuse any mistakes. To give a TLDR, it works.. pretty damn well. That said, i want to make some notes about it first. I also want to make it known that this video will only be hosted here. If you want to show people this video, link this thread. Reason being, i would love for this site to grow.

1) It is only a tool. And you know the golden rules for using tools... A TOOL IS ONLY AS GOOD AS THE PERSON USING IT. What i mean by this, is that taking proper measurements is actually more complicated than people give credit to, and sometimes interpriting them is even harder. I'm sure you have seen the typical "rta doesnt tell you everything, use your ears".. Like i said, it is a tool that is often misunderstood.

2) The auto eq works well and is actually easy to use. That said, there are still things that you need to understand to make decent use of it. You need a basic understanding of how audio works and how to use a dsp and basic tuning knowledge will help. You still have to set crossovers, set signal delay, and set up your input/output matrixing. Also applying any input correction if needed. To get the most out of the auto eq, you will want to make sure that there are no phase issues between pairs of drivers, and through crossover ranges. You will want to make sure that each channel is level matched as closely as possible. You will want to make sure your crossovers are actually behaving through the crossover region, meaning there is no early roll off, no phase issues, etc etc.. You can still make use of the auto eq feature without knowing this stuff and just setting crossover and TA, but it will obviously not be as good and you wont get as much out of your setup as you could be.

3) It works, and pretty damn well. I have been using the tune you see in the video below for about 4 days now, and frankly i would probably ok with giving this to a customer. I say probably because its not perfect, but its still good. I have to go back in and adjust a few frequencies (i personally am very sensitive in the 2.5k-5k region to the point where a typical house curve is a bit painful for me in that region). I also say probably becasue i think i can get the center a bit tighter after a bit of "by ear" adjustments. That said, this is a new install for me in my car, and i dont know its potential by doing a tune with REW or with Systune, or by ear. In my previous installs in this car, i have done multiple tunes using every method you can possibly think of, and am familiar with the potential of the previous setup. I am not fully familiar with the potential with the new setup. That said, the new setup with the auto eq already sounds better than the car ever has, but i'm positive thats due to the install. TLDR: its good, surprisingly good actually, but im psoitive i could do better with my other methods that take 10x or more the amount of time (systune and verification by ear).

4) this is not a professional quality video. Just me filming as i was figuring stuff out. sue me (edit: ha, if you know, you know lol)





Hi! New to this forum and I wonder why this clip is not available? It says it´s private and it I am not able to watch it. Any ideas why?
 
Nick said in another video that he wasn't happy with his older vids, he doesn't feel they reflect his brand...so he's looking to redo them.
 
Maybe he could start a Pisspigeon Youtube channel and put his old (but useful) videos there so they don't reflect badly on his brand. Just a thought.
 
Re: Helix RTA & Auto EQ - A Car Audio Junkies Exclusive

In the same boat in not seeing the video. Is there a write-up I can read on how to do the auto eq?
I took a screenshot of this part of the video. Maybe it will be helpful to you.

In the video he linked left side, right side, and subs individually and ran the auto eq on each group.

The process is quite simple and very fast. I've had pretty good luck with it.
b7476696236eeecd34ab542db13cb4c4.jpg


Sent from my SM-G955U1 using Tapatalk
 
It would be nice if some installers would post the house curves they used on specific cars and setups so that a "Library" could be created. The problem is that tuning is subjective for the most part, and different components and cars need additional tuning anyway, so just following a standard curve and playing around with it are probably your best bet. The best thing I have seen recently is the testing being done by Erin, he is testing speakers and posting the results, this is not subjective. Good speakers are very important in a system.
I have used the curves given in the Hellix software(ATF Ref.) , they are great starting places, eventually I boosted the bass up higher (+11db) and kept it flat from 200-3.2k, drop off to -5db up to 20k. My slope is much steeper from low to mid, the ref curve is more gradual. I am very happy with my bass response, but the mids and uppers need a little tweaking. Someday I would like to do a sound test and see how the steep slope sounds compared to the more gradual slope, on both the low and high end. this is the fun with car audio , the tuning never ends....
 
Nearly all of the room/house curves come from Floyd Toole's (et al.) Research and where they curve needs to fall to sound reasonable. There is some leeway here, but for the most part all of the curves I have seen fall within that threshold, usually it is increased bass or decreased highs, which is within the threshold.

When I get home I will see if I can get a picture of where the curve needs to all from his sound reproduction book. This was discovered from many abx tests on what people preferred when they listened (subjective) and then gathering the objective data of what these speakers all had in common.

Link to the book, WELL worth the read:
https://smile.amazon.com/Sound-Repr...argid=pla-417309388218&psc=1&sa-no-redirect=1
 
Floyd's book is indeed a great read. Its one of the only books I seen that uses subjective listening tests and plots the data. I found a whole bunch of pics doing a google search. What I find interesting , is that the untrained listeners preferred a huge boost in the bass area. The thing I wonder about is, his data is based on using high quality speakers in a reflective room at home. The car environment is totally different, you may be able to get high quality speakers, but they are not aligned flat to each other (phase aligned) and the glass causes more reflections than a home setting. plus: road noise, engine noise, etc. This is why it would be great if some IASCA or other sound competition winners would post there curves, it would be great data since you have many people agreeing that it sounds good. Most are probably reluctant to do so, since they pay a lot of money to have a "competition tune" and would not just give away that information for free. As for the helix software, it would be great if the processors and software could dynamically tune the system according to the varying noise levels. Alpine had a unit years ago that said it could do it, but I don't think it was effective . We may not be at that level of technology yet, but it would be a game changer.
Subjectively-preferred-steady-state-room-curve-targets-in-a-typical-domestic-listening.png
 
Thanks for posting that blog post, Andy has excellent advice, I use his tuning methods. my house curve looks a lot like Andy's black curve and I'm happy with it.
 
Yup, basically the same result Floyd got, As long as it falls within a certain boundary, it is usually acceptable to most people, with a little personal flavor added here and there.


I think a competition tune is just who did all of the stuff the best, as in who matched EQ between the speakers the best, and phase, and used high quality low distortion drivers (doesn't mean expensive), etc.
 
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